Here is a link to a local artical on political signs. This year was light on signs and we did not have many violations. It does apear that those running for office have found that the voting public is tiered of there trash on the ROW.

http://jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/032207/met_8793614.shtml


"If your not living on the edge you are taking up to much space" unknown

Attachment #1, (com/tu-online/stories/032207/met_8793614 file)

From the article:

"City Council District 6 candidate Sean Reichard woke up at 4 a.m. Tuesday, Election Day, to find about 50 of his campaign signs thrown in his yard"

...and...

"The city has not fined any candidates so far this election season and does not keep track of the complaints, according to Tom Goldsbury, chief of building inspection. It would take too much time to track violators - making a $250 citation not worth the effort, he said."

What the heck is it with these bureaucrats? 50 * $250 = $12,500. That's not worth the effort? EVEN IF (and that's a very big if) the money isn't worthy of the Building Inspection department's attention, a fine of that magnitude against a city council candidate would certainly put an immediate stop to illegal sign placement by ALL candidates. They'd only have to levy a fine like that once, and it would definitely be remembered for many years to come.

remora
--
remora@resourceful.com

yup

plus, those council guys only have a few thousand in the bank for their campaigns anyway.... hit that guy with 50 signs for $12,500 and his campaign is in big trouble...

ya gotta understand though, most code enforcement peeps work for those elected council members thru the chain of gov't.... don't bit the hand that feeds ya I guess

stop sign spam

later

>>ya gotta understand though, most code enforcement peeps work
>for those elected council members thru the chain of gov't....
>don't bit the hand that feeds ya I guess

I was once told by a code enforcement officer “I wont fine any of those guys, one of them just may be my next boss". Now that’s true integrity, NOT.

To add, the local news will run a segment on campaigning saying that candidates must remove their campaign signs within seven days of the election or the city will remove them and stor them in the city warehouse. No mention of any fine either. So basically, if you loose your campaign, don’t worry about being responsible and pick up your trash, I MEAN, Campaign signs, the city will do it for you.

Making a difference and keeping it clean

Previous comments are right on! It's unfortunate when a city code official says its not worth tracking violators for a $250 violation. Thier job is to keep the city clean, not to focus on recovering costs through fines.

I think the political signs, especially the local ones, tend to be tolerated even if illegal. As someone said, don't piss off the person who might be your boss.

Political signs in Dallas proper have been better behaved in the last 3-4 years. I recall about 5 years ago, the candidates for sherrif, DA, Constable, and some judges had their signs all over the medians and roadways.

Newbie (not)

Attached are two pictures. This is a polling location. I think it is legal to post signs on election day at the polling location. One of the signs says "Today". This is an example of political signs on public property.

Attachment #1, (jpg file)
Attachment #2, (jpg file)

Political signs on public property is an interesting question. I got trapped in a finger-pointing exercise between the Dallas (city) Parks & Recreation Dept and the Dallas (county) Elections Department. My position continues to be that only official election signs (e.g., distance markers, official polling location) are permitted on public property. Campaign signs (e.g., vote for Joe Blow) have no place on public property. There appears to have been a written agreement between the Parks people and the Elections people that there would be a marked area in the grass lawn of the recreation center where campaigns could put their signs. This was what was allowed for the three weeks of early voting. I could not get anyone in any department to take any action to remove the signs. Of course, I did not remove them.

In the case of a public school, the decision about campaign signs on election day was left up to the principal of the school. There was no basis for the policy of the principal other than personal judgment. Fortunately, the principal did not have a selective policy about whose signs could be there and whose couldn't.

Yet another interesting case comes up in relation to campaign signs on church property, especially when the church is used as a polling place. Of course under current IRS regulations churches, as 501 (c)(3) organizations can not take partisan positions or favor certain candidates. At my own church which is a polling place on election day, I, with the knowledge of the church administrator, remove all the campaign signs on church property. The campaign workers come around several times on election day and angrily maintain they must be permitted to put up signs. The campaign workers even threatened to call the police once, which I said was fine and that I would wait for them. They decided not to call and left after calling me all sorts of names.

Newbie (not)

This is early voting, and there are very few signs. Last election day, there were a few hundred signs. On Election Day, the candidates will put their signs out. I counted 30 signs from One candidate alone. There were multiple signs from multiple candidates. I will not be in that area on Election Day, but I know there will be a few hundred at minimum. They just cover the area, like only a picture can show.

Rather amusing, the sign that says, “Vote Yes” is for a new convention center. This city obstinately missed getting the worlds largest sports facility. Another city got the bid and contract. The attached picture shows a bandit sign in front of that new stadium being built.

Attachment #1, (jpg file)

>Political signs on public property is an interesting question.

Like most laws and regulations, it depends on the jurisdiction. What is legal in your city may not be legal in mine, etc., etc.

I have had a running battle with the signs around the polling places for years. I'm right, but still losing.

Texas State law says very specifically that campaign signs or meet and greet campaigners can not be closer than XXX yards or feet to the poling place. I don't know the actual number but it is something like 300 feet. The various campaigns take this to mean that anything outside this boundry is allowed by state law. This is not the case.

The State election law does not say where the signs can be, it just says where they can't be. And there is nothing in the State election law that trumps local signs laws. A sign in the ROW or on public property is still illegal in Austin, even on election day. I think you will find this is true for most, if not all, jusrisdictions in Texas, and I am guessing in other states as well.

But I have learned that pushing the issue is like pushing string, so anymore I just grit my teeth and put up with it until the election is over and the signs are gone. It is not worth raising my blood pressure for a 1 or 2 day event.

What I did do once, if front of a news crew, was tell a meet and greet candidate at my polling place that I voted for someone else because of his numerous illegal signs on public ROW leading up to the elction and the failure of his campaign to do anything about it after they had been advised of it numerous times. Did it help anything - no. The candidates are like cockroaches - we get new ones every year and they all seem to need to be educated. But it did make me feel better.

I have also confronted meet and greet candidates and campaign workers by telling them that if they didn't get their selves and signs back behind the boundry I would immediately lodge a complaint with the county election officials. It's like flashing a cross at a vampire - they move back is a hurry!

Illegal Signs in Austin

In Texas, there should be a sign outside the polling place that says "distance marker". This is supposed to be 100 feet from the entrance (or entrances) to the building. No campaign signs, people campaigning, or even political pins or T-shirts are allowed with this distance. Of course, it is up to the election judge to place the marker and to enforce the rules. What happens beyond the distance marker is up for grabs.

Newbie (not)

Check out this picture. A RP sign is at the top of a pole?

Attachment #1, (jpg file)

Wow, you guys are a pathetic bunch, aren't you. I'd better not catch any of you on any of my properties removing Ron Paul signs. I don't care about the Austin singles signs etc. But you had better leave Ron Paul alone.
It is our first amendment right, to freedom of speech.and these signs are no more distracting than any of the other million signs along the road.
If you spent any time doing any research instead of being a raggedy bunch of vigilantes,you would understand that our country is in DEEP ####. our economy is in DEEP ####, and it is not going to get any better with any of the other liers that are running for president.
I would use your efforts in getting the only honest guy on the stage elected,otherwise we are going to lose our sovereignty,our money, the rest of our rights,etc.,etc.
WAKE UP PEOPLE, for God's sake WAKE UP

<<Wow, you guys are a pathetic bunch, aren't you.>>

Calling us "pathetic” does not bode well for your cause. You do not understand the big picture, as you say. You may be judged and insulted, by the example you set.

<<I'd better not catch any of you on any of my properties removing Ron Paul signs.>>

If your signs were on private property, I would not remove them. I may notify Code Enforcement.

<<It is our first amendment right, to freedom of speech.>>

It is your right to verbally insult people, as you have done. It is Not your right to trash the roadway on public property when the law reads it is not legal.

Your comments show your intention to break the law and portray you as a donkey. You are acting like a hildibeast operative, so you guys need to stay away from this site. You will not gain any votes here, but only lose them.

Place the signs on private property, and you will not get any complaints from me.

>Your comments show your intention to break the law and portray
>you as a donkey.

Ron Paul's a Republican. Don't you mean elephant?

:-D :-D

>Wow, you guys are a pathetic bunch, aren't you. I'd better
>not catch any of you on any of my properties removing Ron Paul
>signs.

Wake up your self. Nobody here is talking about removing Rue Paul signs from private property. What is being talked about is removing illegal signs from public property and rights-of-way.

Yes, wakeup boy, it is illegal in Austin and nealry every other jurisdiction in this country to install a private purpose sign on public property and rights-of-way. And that includes political signs, which can only be installed on private property, and only then with the owner's or owner's agent's permission.

And if you and your buddies keep doing it, the only right you will have will be the right to an attorney when you are arrested.

Now quit trashing my town with your illegal signs!

Illegal Signs in Austin

> It is our first amendment right, to freedom of speech.

Best go back and read US Supreme Court Rulings 101. They say otherwise.

>is not going to get any better with any of the other liers
>that are running for president.

"liers"? Interesting descriptor. One of the two major confrontational issues that we don't discuss on the CAUSS forums is religon - the other being politics.

> I would use your efforts in getting the only honest guy on
>the stage elected,otherwise we are going to lose our
>sovereignty,our money, the rest of our rights,etc.,etc.
>WAKE UP PEOPLE, for God's sake WAKE UP

This reeks of an alarmist - almost like screaming FIRE, FIRE, FIRE in an opera house with only once exit.
And - BTW- TX law is very specific about any type of signs in the public ROW's. Last time I looked, there was NO exception for Mr. Paul.


GW

You are right... You will not catch me on your property.... However, I go out of my way to remove any Ron Paul sign on the public ROW around here. It's litter, and it's trash. And this campaign is a special project with such flagrant illegally posted signs.

I think political signs are wonderful, and I don’t want people to get the wrong idea about me.
I have seen some political signs in the ROW, and that's OK by me. This is a tradition started long before most of the ROW laws were created. Besides, political signs are not a commercial enterprise seeking profit and they are Temporary. They will go away on their own accord. It shows a participation in our most important inalienable right. (To vote). They are legally litter, and open for removal. I don’t think any less of a person who removes them.

Some communities seem to have a big problem with multiple signs per candidate in one location. Some consider this an eyesore, and I can understand that situation.

I just want to go on record with this. These RP people think we all are removing their signs, and that’s not the case with me. I do not remove missing pets and children, political, temporary Holiday signs, or garage sale signs (until Monday). I remove signs that are ugly, and political signs are beautiful to me; even if I don’t agree with the candidate.

I got into a discussion once about illegal signs with a candidate I supported. He explained his viewpoint and I explained mine. Actually, he made some good points - for example, there were very few ways to make his name known.

I have also discussed the issue with various CE departments. Denver CE tried leaving political signs up one year and it was a real mess. Even though political signs are illegal, removing signs caused some candidates to whine about biased removal.

After many years helping clean up our cities, I now generally leave political signs alone, unless they are clustered and prolific.

This is a personal choice, based mainly upon my support of the political process that made America great (which I hope we can restore). The signs are temporary and are non-commercial, even though candidates receive thousands from corporations

I'm sure that others have their own preferences regarding political signs. And it really comes down to individual preference.

CAUSS has no official policy or mandate on political signs. The objective is primarily to rid our communities of unsightly, recurring street spam - which is unquestionably commercial.

DenverShark

>The objective is primarily to rid our communities of
>unsightly, recurring street spam - which is unquestionably
>commercial.

Yep, that's what political signs are - unsightly, recurring street spam.

Our CE will take any and all, as long as there is a complaint as our's is a complaint driven process.

Illegal Signs in Austin

Ok. However, let's not let this thread degenerate into flames. We've made our points.

Gotta run - there's some fresh yellow coroplast that needs attending to

DenverShark

>Ok. However, let's not let this thread degenerate into
>flames. We've made our points.

You're not getting flamed, the trash in the ROW is. May you all have warm holiday fires!

Illegal Signs in Austin

If it's in the ROW, its trash. Like any other litter.

In my area, the only ones disobeying the laws about campaign signs are the Rue Paul supporters. They are the only ones nailing signs to telephone poles (expressly forbidden by local law) and to publicly owned fences (expressly disallowed) and doing other vandalism (yes gluing a sign to a street sign is vandalism). Rue Paul supporters are even creating dangerous situations by placing banners where they will blow down into freeway traffic. It really says allot about a candidate when his supporters so readily ignore the law to get him elected. What's next Rue Paul supporters? Electioneering at a polling place? Vote fraud? I have already seen your threats of violence on your board. Keep in mind that most of the country is Right to Carry now.

I think it's time to lock this thread. All the threads that reference placement of Ron Paul signs seem to wander off topic or start getting personal.

Newbie (not)